used 1256 engine and box fitment

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used 1256 engine and box fitment

Postby shuvit-tim » 05 Jan 2006, 15:53

1256 engine refitting...... i can forsee a few problems so i thought i'd start a thread to keep it all in one....

1) what dimensions are the bolts that mount the manifold to the head?
2) what oil do you put in a chevette - all i remember is 10W40 is too thin when hot!
3) what size nuts fit over the engine mount threads!?
4) where can i get an air filter from!?
5) can a 1256 alternator cope with 4 big spotlamps
6) How do you add transmision fluid to a chevette box?
7) Should there be a gasket between box and engine?
8 ) which bolts - other than the fan - are reverse thread!?
9) anything else i should know or be warned about?

*more questions to follow having seen the engine*

it's not paranoia..... every time i've tried to fix her something else has gone wrong. most of it my fault...not risking this one
when all else fails, rivets, cable ties and bodge tape will see you through

Tim
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Postby Shellysowner » 05 Jan 2006, 15:58

2/ 20W50 Mineral - I use Duckhams
4/ Me, you got PM.
5/ Depends on the spotlamps but if they are big beefy b*stards then I'd guess not! It also depends which alternator you've got as IIRC there are edit... 28, 35 and 45 - watt versions.
6/ Through the plug in the lhs of the 'box - should be a pic of it (edit... there is, I just checked, page 58.) in the Haynes.
7/No.
Last edited by Shellysowner on 05 Jan 2006, 16:38, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Herbie_Flowers » 05 Jan 2006, 17:25

1) dunno the thread length but i'm 99% sure they're 13mm heads (both manifolds).
8 ) i have known some crank pulley bolts to be left hand thread but they are rare.
9) a chevette engine swap is quite possibly the easiest one you will ever do.

i take it from number 7 you have left the gearbox in place and ripped your engine out? might i suggest removing your gearbox and mate it to the engine and then install the 2 together as trying to line up the input shaft with the spigot bearing while the gearbox is in situ is not fun especially if the clutch is slightly out :wink:
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Postby Harry Flatters » 05 Jan 2006, 19:16

1. I think 5/16 UNC x about 1 1/2", but can check at weekend

2. 20W/50

3. I think around M10 but can check at weekend

4. eBay, motor factors, the usual suspects

5. IME yes, but fitting a bigger alternator is easy

6. I hope you don't mean transmission fluid - or is it an auto?

7. No

8. None

9. What Herbie says. If you've got the 'box split from the engine check the clutch while you're in there & change if needed. Check the studs / threads on the exhaust manifold - downpipe flange & sort out if needed - it's a lot easier while it's all out. If you're fitting the engine & box together drop the prop off and refit afterwards - easier than trying to fit it as you go. Put a bag over the end of the 'box & tape or cable tie on, unless it's empty, so it doesn't pour gear oil all over the floor.
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Postby shuvit-tim » 05 Jan 2006, 21:31

thanks guys. i pulled my engine out still mated to the gearbox. Just a case of prizing it apart and mating to the new block...

gearbox is already empty. do i just pull the prop from the axle or is there a UJ i should undo? if its a case of sliding the prop out of the axle, wont it be too long to refit with the box mounted in place?
when all else fails, rivets, cable ties and bodge tape will see you through

Tim
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Postby shuvit-tim » 05 Jan 2006, 22:22

OTHER POTENTIAL PROBLEMS:
i'm guessing there's a fair chance there will be other problems that will need checking as the car has been sat fr 18 months.
so any ideas what to check?....

- guessing the brakes may be ceased, although i'm hoping they'll lossen up without the pistons being too ceased :S

- i'll put an inline fuel filter on the fuel line ot the carb as i'm not ruling out the fuel in th etankbeing full of crap.

- oil change and new oil filter obviously

- will the suspension be ok despite having been sat for 18months?
when all else fails, rivets, cable ties and bodge tape will see you through

Tim
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Postby Neilyman » 05 Jan 2006, 23:47

1. They`re metric 13mm head M10? 30mm..ish for the exhaust...2 long `uns & a short `un for inlet :)

2. Duckhams Q

3. as Harry says!

4. Ralph..

5. Change it for a bigger output, depends on bulb wattage, but working at full chat kills alternators quickly.

Rest as Harry said ;)
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Postby shuvit-tim » 05 Jan 2006, 23:51

Neilyman wrote:1. They`re metric 13mm head M10? 30mm..ish


ish? ISH!? now let me think.... steel screw, cast head...... ish leads to a head needing to be retapped!

i suppose i can check bolts with the old engine
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Postby Herbie_Flowers » 05 Jan 2006, 23:57

here's a proper tip for ya Young Tim. to find out how long your bolt needs to be there has to be at least 1.5 x the thickness of it screwed into the thread. so for a 10mm thick bolt 15mm needs to be screwed in to the thread for it to be used safely.
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Postby shuvit-tim » 05 Jan 2006, 23:58

*scribbles on memory* cheers chief!

this manifold thing may be irrelevant. i forgot temporarily that it isnt a crossflow head so it might still have exhaust manifold attached but out of sight.....

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Last edited by shuvit-tim on 06 Jan 2006, 00:02, edited 1 time in total.
when all else fails, rivets, cable ties and bodge tape will see you through

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Postby Neilyman » 05 Jan 2006, 23:59

shuvit-tim wrote:
Neilyman wrote:1. They`re metric 13mm head M10? 30mm..ish


ish? ISH!? now let me think.... steel screw, cast head...... ish leads to a head needing to be retapped!



Only if you`re an inexperienced total tosspot, who like to keep turning bolts until they cannot possibly go any tighter!!!!!!!!

What d`ya want us to do Tim?............Strip half the bolts out of our motors, measure them, & put them all back?????

i suppose i can check bolts with the old engine


Yeah, you could, well thought out young Tim, So the Uni education wasn`t a waste of time then?

:lol: :lol: :lol:
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Postby shuvit-tim » 06 Jan 2006, 00:05

very kind of you to offer to do that neily! :wink: :lol:

the uni education is a complete waste of time up until i find a job!
when all else fails, rivets, cable ties and bodge tape will see you through

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Postby Neilyman » 06 Jan 2006, 00:08

:mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen:
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Postby Herbie_Flowers » 06 Jan 2006, 00:13

shuvit-tim wrote:do i just pull the prop from the axle or is there a UJ i should undo? if its a case of sliding the prop out of the axle, wont it be too long to refit with the box mounted in place?

the prop slides into the back of the gearbox and there should be enough movement in it when refitting the engine and 'box. don't lose the spring out of the propshaft or you'll be fooked. is the car sat on it's wheels as you may have to move it slightly if the splines on the shaft aren't lined up with the 'box.
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Postby shuvit-tim » 06 Jan 2006, 00:22

car is on it's wheels. is which end of the prop is this spring?
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Postby Shuvit-pinto » 06 Jan 2006, 00:28

which end of the prop is this spring?


Pointy end :wink: the skinny end :lol: the bit that goes into the back of the box Tim. :?
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Postby shuvit-tim » 06 Jan 2006, 00:35

oh now this doesnt bode well....i dont remember anything about a spring when i pulled the box from the prop...... :?

best head to the yard where she's kept and check the box, prop and underneath the car...just in case i need this guys prop/box as well!

how big is this spring?
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Postby Shuvit-pinto » 06 Jan 2006, 01:15

YOU LOST IT :shock:

The spring fits inside the slidey end of the prop Tim. I would guess its about 4" max length and about 1" max diameter.
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Postby Harry Flatters » 06 Jan 2006, 08:18

1. They`re metric.....


One of the oddities of the Chevette is the frame's Opel - hence metric - the engine's Vauxhall (Viva) - hence imperial - they were never metricated. Just checked the parts list, they're given as 5/16" x 13 TPI x 2" long, but I have an engine on the floor so can check.


Spring is 9103958 if you're looking on eBay!

here's a proper tip for ya ......


Also make sure, with a blind hole, the bolt isn't so long that it bottoms - apart from the fact it won't clamp the component you risk doing lots of damage.
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Postby shuvit-tim » 06 Jan 2006, 09:59

you guys are stars. on the spring front, there is a lorry mechanic next door to where my chevettes is who is my dads best mate. He has a wall of drawers about 15 meters longs, 6ft high dedicated to nuts, bolts, fixings, springs etc. I've never presented him with anything he hasnt been able to find yet, so if push comes to shuvit i'll try to get an approximate spring fitting.
when all else fails, rivets, cable ties and bodge tape will see you through

Tim
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Postby jifop » 06 Jan 2006, 12:10

shuvit-tim wrote:*scribbles on memory* cheers chief!

this manifold thing may be irrelevant. i forgot temporarily that it isnt a crossflow head so it might still have exhaust manifold attached but out of sight.....

Image


look at the bottom RHS of the picture, looks like a bit of exzaust with manifold flang attached?
Before you say anything..... no i cant spell or type!

The post above is my own personal opinion, it is not meant to upset or cause offence, if it does bugger off.

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Postby shuvit-tim » 06 Jan 2006, 19:45

was indeed a manifold - but he had shortened it atr some point ot fit an ashley to it.

right, picke dup the engine. he has a full HS interior and 2.3 slant four engine.

the engine seems good if not a little tatty. I'm having to pull bits and bobs off the old engine for this one, just little bits here and there which are missing. I've also found a complete gasket set, brand new, which will come in handy.

I'm afraid he had none of the requested bits that y'all wanted :(

on th epesky spring front..... he had two props and one gearbox - neither with the spring - but he can remember it pinging out on separating them. On the plus side, i had a close look inside the part of the gearbox that the prop slides into and a bit of a prod with a piece of metal showed their to be a spring in there, located at 3/4 inch from the end. this sound about right?

i have the two engines together up on a bench, nailed to some oak blocks through the engine mounts to hold them steady, ready for me to work on tomorrow. pictures to follow shortly...
Last edited by shuvit-tim on 07 Jan 2006, 20:52, edited 1 time in total.
when all else fails, rivets, cable ties and bodge tape will see you through

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Postby shuvit-tim » 06 Jan 2006, 20:40

ok here are the piccys....

Image
....the red arrow points to what i believe to be the gearbox-prop spring

Image
.....set up ready to pull bits off one engine to bolt onto the other. the one on th eleft is the 'new' engine
Image

Image

Image

Image
when all else fails, rivets, cable ties and bodge tape will see you through

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Postby shuvit-tim » 06 Jan 2006, 20:52

current problems..... just the one! - my gearbox - the internals appear ot have come out of the casing by about 4 inches...it doesnt seem to want to just slide back in... ideas?

plan for tomorrow: have a good look at the clutch to check it is ok. swap bits from old engine to new to complete it. (little pipes here and there). remove gearbox from old engine and relocate the internals fully, then fit it to the new engine. fit starter motor, exhaust manifold, alternator. Drop engine onto mounts, secure gearbox mounting, engine mounting and locate prop. Fit rad and connect all hosing. If I get time i'll attach the loom, but i'll see what progress I make.

plan for sunday: refit steering wheel (dont ask) and seats, finish adding loom, check electrics function. Change oil and filter, air filter, spark plugs. check it turns and fires! if it does..... check brakes. if they work, take it for a little drive and try to identify any problems for mot. if none exist tidy it up, deal with the rust on the rear nearside arch. Clean and t-cut

monday: mot.....


wednesday (on justins arrival): weld either steel plates or steel bars into the floorpan to attach the seats more securely.
when all else fails, rivets, cable ties and bodge tape will see you through

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Postby novadrive-motorsport » 06 Jan 2006, 23:35

Eeekkkk, never write a list like that mate, it's looks daunting! I have every faith in you though, you have PDC...... Pride, Determination & "Carry on Regardless"ness

Cheers to everyone on here for all the help and advice, you've made Tim the veritable shuvit encyclopedia that he is today, the world is forever indebted! lol

Getting very excited now, small pang of doubt is beginning to get shadowed by growing sense of we can do this! lol

Cheers,

Justin ;o)
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